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117434-drop-3-when
Content ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- Fair enough. It just feel that we will never get that patch. it's taking forever......... | |} ---- ---- ---- ---- They would straight up lose that fight. | |} ---- ---- Many players have proven their loyalty to the game, already. Many decisions that have been made can and will not be understood by many community members. We are waiting 2+ months (more like 3), now. What else would you call "patient"? Time is up. | |} ---- ---- I would also like to be in before lock. Also, to borrow one of my favourite phrases from Yoshi-P.... Please look forward to it. | |} ---- 201x-ish | |} ---- What year? | |} ---- in before hover cars? | |} ---- Not True. Actually for weeks there were players posting and complaining about how often Wildstar patched and at what time. Lately they have slowed that down a lot but it was happening several times a week for the first few months to be honest. My understanding was that it stopped for the next drop, only weekly plus hot fixes until then. At least it seems that way. | |} ---- This is part of a pipeline issue unfortunately. Now from what I'm understanding Carbine has stated that they'll never be doing this approach afterward with having "everything" bunched up into one patch like this. From my own working experience my guess at why we aren't getting bits and pieces of drop 3 is the way that the build may be integrated either technically or from a "ecosystem" of changes. As example you wouldn't want to have rune crafting changes without the AP/SP changes to go with it or the warrior ability revamps to go without the AP/SP changes either... WhatI'm hoping to see going forward after this drop is that the Drops will contain major changes and development while we receive minor changes/fixes/tweaks in between. This remains to be seen though so cross that bridge when we get there. Now as for when this patch will be ready, I really don't know. Part of me wants to say "go for it already!" The other part is like "eh..." because I really can't give an honest input on how warrior tanking has changed with such an old outdated character and there are some little bugs here and there as well that I and others have noticed as well and reported. The earliest If I HAD to guess would maybe be November 11th...and latest probably Thanksgiving....heh... (No turkey for you Carbine!) | |} ---- ---- ---- And Smash wii u, don't forget smash wii u! | |} ---- I totally agree with this: More Testers Testing + Bug Reporting = Faster and Better Drop Releases (at least that's the hope) | |} ---- I just wish they still had those ummm like things you could walk with your pokemon on those were the bomb! | |} ---- And on that note: Why doesn't Carbine just give players free game time or boomboxes to help them test the PTR? I logged on once and it was almost completely dead. | |} ---- Why doesn't Carbine give some free game time out for people BETA testing the game after it was released? Other MMOs have done it including WOW and SWTOR (prior before it went FTP). | |} ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- Which I think is fine and a great way to get people on board. They've done it a few times with particular events like testing daggerpass as I recall. Wouldn't mind seeing them do more of that. | |} ---- Except, they gave us boombox's + game time for downtime for Megaserver... | |} ---- Carbine gave compensation for the long hours of downtime because they represented a denial of service. Technically how things go: We pay for access to the game, that's it. We don't pay Carbine to make the game we want any more than I pay Terry Pratchett to write the book I want— I pay Terry Pratchett to read the story he's offering me, and most entertainment mediums work the same way. ;) | |} ---- I don't think that many people are really on the fence trying to decide between WoW and WildStar. Most people who are planning to play WoW when WoD releases have probably already pre-ordered it. If Drop 3 is released a week before WoD, you can count on those people burning through the Drop 3 content before jumping ship. | |} ---- if only we had teh patience of wow subs, they waited 13+ months for anything. | |} ---- There was no real competition, there is a reason why EQ, GW1, CoH, Matrix Online, DDO, SWG never became super popular (even with the latter having the SW franchise to flaunt). Now you may have loved one of those previous games, thats great - again there is a reason why they were never popular and why not all of them are alive anymore. Right now you have 2 of the biggest MMOs releasing new content and you have a new MMO releasing every month or two, the market is flooded. | |} ---- That is not true. They at least got bug fixes. Real bug fixes - not like Gamma Ray fixes. | |} ---- It's about time they split the bug fixes from the content and just release whatever is ready. | |} ---- WoW already has a strong foundation with plenty of content for all. It's ridiculous when we have to wait over 3 months for bug fixes because they want to push everything into 1 patch | |} ---- ---- You do realize there is 27 more days in the month of November right... | |} ---- ---- There is not 27 more days until the "main" competition has its expansion 11.13.14 (13th of November 2014). With a new expansion people on the fence may/will be a lot harder to bring back from WOW potentially. | |} ---- ---- You do realize Cougar and company first said "first week of November" with the earliest to drop would be "October 21st" then in an interview online about 3 weeks ago backpedaled even more in their statements to "first or second week of November". Either way, with nothing but silence coming from the devs right now and the deadlines they set for themselves quickly approaching all is not looking so well on that front at the moment. | |} ---- ---- Timeline changed from late October- early November to early November - mid November.... | |} ---- Ehm.. yes? | |} ---- ---- Do you have any idea how long it would take to "split the bug fixes from the content" and test it? It would take longer to do that than to just test and release the content they are already in the process of finalizing. | |} ---- Nope I have no idea. They were the ones that said that things like the rune changes would be released asap and not tied to a drop. I'm sorry for being an idiot and listening to what they said in the past, I've learnt now their word is dirt. | |} ---- When did they say things like rune changes would not be tied to a drop? It's one thing to roll out individual bug fixes (which is different from a systematic change like the rune changes) in between drops if they are created with that intent. But to split code out of a branch it is already in is a significant amount of work, especially the number of bug fixes they are talking about. Also, if rune changes are what you are interested in, it's pretty clear that they were always planned after the new content but they held up the new content to get the rune changes in faster. | |} ---- Not for nothing but those people were never on the fence to begin with. They've been doing this song and dance for a very long time. They play WoW, get bored, go to another MMO, convince themselves this is the one this time that will keep them away from WoW, get bored (again), talk about how the next WoW expansion will sink the game they're currently playing unless "something something..." and slowly convince themselves they have "no choice" but to go back to WoW if the game they're playing doesn't improve, and then sure enough they go back to WoW to play that expansion. *repeat until hell freezes over* | |} ---- I agree with you here. After looking at the lack of content on the ptr after the patch has been put off for months now, I'm more inclined to believe that "bug free, because they listened to the players" was simply a management ruse. It seems at this point, that Carbine is just incompetent, and that management are dirty liars. | |} ---- ---- ---- I think the timing of Drop 3 won't matter either way in regards to the effect WoD will have on WS. Might not be a great day for pugging, though. | |} ---- Oh you mean... it is impossible to test bug fixes in old content? :D I see. New perspective here. How do current and present bugs relate to new unpublished content? In addition, bug fix team = content team? Or is the bundle team saying... "oh you only have some fixes... nope we wait until some new content is up.. because reasons!" The only thing I am reading is, it takes more time.... If this is the really the case, a lot of people should be fired and other people should create a way better system to be able to push fixes and push content when its ready. | |} ---- ---- ---- It's a trap! | |} ---- ---- I wouldn't doubt it considering how batcupcake crazy Eldan turn out to be more you play... I swear the more I played the more I was like "what the hell is wrong with you people..." | |} ---- Hubris and too much free time. | |} ---- I wonder how much laying off 60 employees helped. | |} ---- Managing fixes alongside existing and new content is an issue with software everywhere, not just at Carbine. Millions of words have likely been written on the subject of managing defects and patches, and while some systems are better, frankly none make it easy. It ALWAYS takes more time. You ask "How do current and present bugs relate to new unpublished content"? I'll explain it: First, it's important to understand that the application is released as one bundle of code compiled down into machine language. Every piece of functionality has to be written and tested against that release of the code. It's not like you can take pieces of drop 1, add in patch 1.2, some from drop 2, and then whatever the difference is for drop 3. No, you get the entire code, from top to bottom that represents the application. The reason they don't push down the entire app to you every time is that there are tools smart enough to determine just what needs to be updated on the client while leaving everything else the same. But this isn't true for the source code and it isn't true of what QA tests. So generally what you have is something called the "trunk". This represents all of the present source code up to now. From that trunk you will have "branches" that basically represent copies of the trunk taken at a point in time but with changes made. Branches can sometimes be merged back into the trunk so that the changes in the branch are integrated with it. There are various branching strategies and I have no idea what Carbine is using. However, to answer your question think of it this way: when Drop 2 comes out, Carbine creates a branch called "Drop 2". This is a point in time copy of the trunk with all the features they wanted implemented in Drop 2. Now they keep developing. Someone finds a bug and they decide to fix it. That fix will go into the trunk so that it doesn't get reverted whenever Drop 3 comes. But they also decide it's important enough to go into Drop 2 (live). So now they make the change in both places. The closer the two copies are to each other, the easier it is to apply, but the more changes that are made in the Trunk, the more you have conflicts which makes patching live very challenging and time consuming. Now if they determine that they aren't going to waste time doing double work and make the changes to the trunk without patching them into Drop 2 they can go much faster and get to Drop 2 faster. The trunk will have all of the content changes plus all of the bug fixes. If (like has been suggested) you want them to take these bug fixes and apply them to live, a developer has to go back, understand the changes, see how they fit into Drop 2, then apply them there. Then, after they do this (time consuming) process for each of those bugs, the whole new version of Drop 2 has to be deployed to QA and tested. And they can't just test the changes- they have to test the existing features from Drop 2 to make sure nothing was inadvertently broken. Is it impossible? No. Is it time consuming? Very. Now if I had to guess at what happened is that when they cut Drop 2 they had at least one more branch of the code (and probably more). The trunk slated for Drop 3 already had the new content in it and there was probably a feature branch already in existence for Drop 4 that had the rune changes in it. The plan would be to merge the Drop 4 changes back into the trunk after Drop 3 when, but that changed when people screamed (rightfully) about needing the rune changes. So the devs decided to go ahead and merge Drop 4 into Drop 3. Drop 4 was probably depending on a lot of the code base of Drop 3, so to merge it into Drop 2 and make it the new trunk probably would have taken way too much time. Instead, they decided to delay Drop 3 and add the changes for Drop 4 into it. Is this exactly what happened? I don't know. I don't know their specific branching strategy. People still argue over best practices today. However, what IS true is that when you want to patch something into live, deployed code with that fix has to be made in at least two places. And if you don't patch it into live and you decide to do it later, it takes a lot of work to make it happen. They have Drop 3 in testing. It's mostly ready to go. The absolute quickest way to get what you want is for them to test what they have and deploy it. Anything else will take a lot more time. | |} ---- Sadly, the answer is C.) there's no Nexus Report or Zero to Fifty this week. They called in sick. | |} ---- Yeah, I saw that. I think Tony takes some twisted satisfaction in proving me wrong. That's fair though, because I do the same in trying to read more into their posts (or lack thereof in this case) than is actually there. | |} ---- It was a bad decision by carbine that will be added to the already huge pile of bad decisions by carbine | |} ---- ---- They're fixing the stuff on the PTR right now. Issues were found. Fixes are required. Just because it's on the PTR doesn't mean it's ready. | |} ---- I haven't seen new patch notes for 2 weeks. Unless you mean right now as the PTR is down and patching. | |} ---- I'm not saying it's next Tuesday, but I'm also not saying it's not next Tuesday. | |} ---- He is the most interesting dev in the world. | |} ---- I'm not thanking you for letting us not know, but I'm also not not thanking your for not letting us not know. Also, its official. I'll be at 100 Eldan Data Fragments before Drop 3. | |} ---- I get it. There can be goals, but everything is contingent on intermediate steps not blowing up. Testing is like that. I do believe I hear the call of a fellow technologist B). | |} ---- I'm all over the map. I've got CW-4 Heavy Gun, CW-4 Greatsword, AS-3 Energy Shield, and I've been itching to get that Luminite-Hybrid Power Core learned day one. Not that I have any clue where Luminite drops. | |} ---- Copyright by Hamaschu | |} ---- Are you saying or not saying a new PTR build will be or not be up? or Drop 3 might or might not be pushed to live? | |} ---- I think he was pretty clear that the things he was not saying, he was also not not saying. :D | |} ---- Hmmm.... | |} ---- ---- ---- This long wait is painful, since there isn't much to do. They made gear very hard to farm in adventures/dungeons to make people busy trying to get it. I gave up farming gear, I am just waiting for drop 3. In the mean time, I have little or no interest to play the game beside raiding with my group 3 times per week. Definitely, I won't keep doing dailies everyday for 3-4 months. It gets very boring. | |} ---- ---- It's official like dinwitt. I'll be at 100 EDF and 1M crafting vouchers before Drop 3. Also, I might quit the game since my sub end at the 11 of november if Drop 3 doesn't come up before. | |} ---- As much as I appreciate the feedback, I really do not think you people are in the position right now to do these kind of jokes/trolling. I want to be entertained by the game, not by you and your posts. | |} ---- ---- You can find notes and discussion on the PTR forums. :) - Team WildStar | |} ---- ---- I can safely say that making threats won't make it happen any sooner. Lighten up- it was funny and he's giving people hope without committing. It was a good post to make. | |} ---- actually they said mid - end of november. Not sure why people constantly scream early november when the last streams and interviews clearly stating something else. | |} ---- Its not a threat, and was never intended to be conveyed as one. That said, by running one of the largest guilds in the game, I get a lot of feedback from 200+ members at all progression levels on how they feel. And i'm sure we're just a drop in the bucket, but any feedback is helpful. It's more of an outside observation from a small niche area of the game. My point is that there is only so much one can do to keep a community together without something for them to consume. I don't see us failing to run 40 man content for awhile, but retraining can be painful to both experienced and new people when you're farming bosses and progressing in endgame content. | |} ---- I wasn't trying to be hostile, but what you said was "if you don't x then expect y. Sounds threatening to me. It's pretty obvious to me they are working as fast as they can. Telling them what will happen if they can't do it any faster doesn't really help much in terms of feedback. They know the stakes. | |} ---- ---- Sorry but no. I'm not trying to debate but they did say late October early November for the date for drop 3. Now they may have changed that later but they did in fact say early November as the latter expected date. EDIT: The 'last' stream may have been when they changed it but they have and did say the other dates as well. | |} ---- ---- Because they don't want duplicate threads on the same topic overwhelming the front page. Tone of the thread has little to no impact on that, they only close the thread if it delves into a flame war. | |} ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ----